NEVADA STATE MUSEUM & HISTORICAL SOCIETY LAS VEGAS, NEVADA THE LAS VEGAS I REMEMBER INTERVIEW WITH TOMMY NELSON KNPR Studios 5151 Boulder Highway Las Vegas, Nevada TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 2 MR. NELSON: My name is Tommy Nelson. I've lived in Boulder City since the very beginning. I came here out of a dance band in Grand Junction, Colorado. I had aspirations of following the big band era as to a livelihood, but with this terrible depression that come along, the bottom fell out of that. I would plainly say I think people were so poor they couldn't even afford to dance. So anyway, my father being down here in Boulder City -- he was the manager of a commissary down on the dam -- and he said, "Tom, if you come on down, I can get you a job." So I thought it over a little bit. And I might mention too, that I was married practically right out of high school, my wife and I, and we had a long, long life together, a good life. So after talking it over with my wife, I thought, "Well, maybe that's the best way to go." So I came on down. And my first impression of Las Vegas -- let me say this, boy, I fully believed -- this is my own personal opinion -- had it not been for the building of Boulder or Hoover Dam, whichever name you prefer to call it, Las Vegas may have been little more than a whistle stop and a water stop for the Union Pacific Railroad, because the building of Boulder Dam was what got the show on the road. So checking in with my dad after I got here, why, he outfitted me with some little clothes that was necessary: A TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 3 pair of Levi Strauss and a blue chambray shirt. Six Companies furnished the rest of it: A hard hat and a pair of rubber boots. So I was assigned my first shift in one of the big diversion tunnels. They're busily engaged digging out, getting ready to divert that river. Because before you can build a dam, you've most certainly got to have that river diverted. So that was a very important part of the project. And let me say this, having never done any hard work in my life, having done nothing but blow that horn, why, I was a little discouraged let me tell you. I said to myself, "Gee, I don't know how much longer I can take this, but I'll give it my all." My foreman came by. A lot of these big trucks were moving in and out of there. They were spilling rocks in the roadway, so I was assigned to keeping that roadway clear. There was a large rock fell off one of the trucks there. Foreman came along and he said to me, "Go down in the tunnel and get a jackhammer and come up and break up this rock here." Well, I hated to admit to him I was so dumb I didn't even know what a jackhammer was. But I had an inkling of an idea it must be a drill. So I went down and picked up the item and I brought it back, stood it alongside of the canyon wall there. Foreman come by. He says, "Nelson, did you find that TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 4 jackhammer?" I said, "I couldn't find a jackhammer, but I found this drill." He started laughing a little bit. He said, "Didn't you know a jackhammer and a drill, that's the same thing?" I said, "No." I said, "I know very little about this kind of work. This is my first time around." I said, "I'm a musician. I'm a trumpet player, and I've never done anything but blow that horn. But bear with me, I'll do my best to make you a good hand." Now as to the diversion tunnels, let me say this, the carbon monoxide gas was so thick in those diversion tunnels that if OSHA had existed in that era, they would have shut it down in ten minutes. A string of lights along the wall looked like somebody striking matches. Not only did you get the carbon monoxide from the trucks, but the drilling and the blasting that took place in there, that gave off some problems too. So between the two of them, I'll tell you, when you came out of that tunnel, you came out with a splitting headache that wouldn't quit. That's the way it was. And hot, hot, hot. I'm not kidding when I tell you that I worked in temperatures of 135 degrees Fahrenheit. It was that hot. Now Six Companies, the contractor, they got by with allowing those big trucks to go in and out of those tunnels because it was a federal job. They could get by with that. But the State of Nevada, that was a no-no, but that was their way out. TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 5 Now after the completion of the diversion tunnels, then of course came the concrete. Now I'm referring to the Arizona side, Tunnels No. 3 and No. 4. So that's where the river was diverted when the time came for that. So I moved from the muck stage, lets call it, to the placing of the concrete in the tunnels. So that was quite a challenge, let me tell you this, with a pair of hip boots and again with extremely hot temperatures. Concrete doesn't run cool, it runs hot. So I stayed with that till this No. 4 tunnel was complete that we were in. Then I moved to the outside, and I was assigned to a truck flagman down in the river bottom. And the purpose of the flagman was to keep these big trucks moving. If so-and-so over here was in good digging, pour it on him. If so-and-so over here had rocks that he couldn't handle, very big rocks, give him just what he could take and no more. The main purpose, again, like I say, was to keep those shovels busy and keep those trucks moving. So let me say this, I threw my arms out of joint a time or two trying to direct them to this shovel or that shovel. And low and behold, this did happen, as to me working a swing shift there as to the flagging position, I heard the swish-swash of an air hose way, way up high on the Nevada side there. And I took a look up there, and here he comes. It looks like a little ant almost falling down there, a high TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 6 scaler. He lights fairly close to where I'm standing. I'm thinking that there was no trucks coming at that particular moment. Well, I made a mad dash over to him to see if anything could be done. But of course, nothing could be done. The poor guy had had it. So I readily got back to my position and trucks were stacking up. Along come a hard-boiled superintendent, and he said to me, "What are you going to do with all of these blankety-blank trucks? Eat 'em?" I said, "I'm doing my best. I'm trying to get 'em going. There's a man killed over here." "Well, get 'em moving. This guy can't hurt anybody." I bring that out as to show you how highball that job was. Now as these big shovels would move down in the bottom there from place to place, there was high voltage electricity required to operate them. So as they would move from one location to another and, bear in mind there's water down there also, so workmen would go along. They had a wooden handle, oh, like on the end of a shovel perhaps, and it had a steel hook down on the bottom where they could grab a hold of this cable and drag it along. Now just think what would have happened if that cable blew up right in front of them. And I wouldn't be a bit surprised that there may have been one or TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 7 two electrocuted down there. But I'm not really aware of that. Another incident I did see as to a man killed, he was riding an agitator down on one of the high lines. He was on top flagging the operator who could visually see where he was going. MR. ANDERSON: What was an agitator? MR. NELSON: An agitator is a vehicle that is used to place concrete such as these gravel trucks that you see going along today. Those are agitators. They're concrete agitators. Well, anyway, I happened to look up there and apparently the cable broke, and down this agitator comes with this guy on top. Well, when he hit the bottom, you know, that was all she wrote for him. So those were two instances that I did see men killed. Now I might mention right about here as a point of interest, that the compensation laws were higher in the state of Arizona than they were in Nevada. So depending on the seriousness of the injury, it would be better to be hurt in Arizona because the compensation laws were better. Nevada you could collect after seven days. And as I recall, Arizona was 15 days. But as to an injury that required a little length of time, better to be in Arizona. Now let me say this, I have seen this as to a workman TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 8 maybe killed and laying in a form there. I didn't see the nature of the accident, but maybe with a canvas covering him up, and he's laying there in the concrete form and awaiting a coroner to come from Arizona over to Nevada to make the coroner's inquest. Now upstream above the dam, perhaps a mile and a half or maybe a little more, there was a ferry went across the river there where his vehicle could be loaded on this ferry, and they moved over into Nevada. Now you could imagine coming from Kingman or way over in that vicinity, Chloride, wherever it might have been, as to what the roads were, and this guy moving along in a '29 Chevy or '30 Model A Ford. However, later on it was good that Nevada made the inquest for Arizona so that didn't have to occur. Now, as to the dam itself, like I say, we've got to get that river diverted. So the trucks, many of these trucks that I'm flagging are going up into the coffer dam area. You've got to put a coffer dam up there on the upstream side to hold back that river so it can be diverted. So many of the trucks that I did flag were sent up in that direction. If they didn't have the proper kind of material aboard the truck, maybe I would send them to another place to make their dumping. So that was kind of a responsible job, you know, as to handling all of those trucks. And would you believe it, for $4 a day, 50 cents an hour, seven days a week, two days TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 9 off a year optional without pay. Now the contractor never had it so good because he had the pick of the nation's best labor at the price he wanted to pay them. If I haven't already said it, two days a year optional without pay, the 4th of July and Christmas. So it was definitely a highball job, but bear in mind, this was the Depression. And I think guys were, you know, they were thankful to have employment. I well recall as to when the river finally was diverted in June of 1933. Now the contractor was moving along real good. They were way out in front in their schedule. And as you can imagine when this river was diverted, there was a lot of dignitaries down there. Oh, this was a big splash, and it was waterwise and otherwise as well. So I was able to observe all of that from my flagging position, however I wasn't right up against it. We finally got that river converted, so excavation is in full now down in the river bottom there, getting ready to place that concrete. Along the canyon walls were high scalers. That was a challenge for a guy to hang up there on a rope sitting in a motion chair. And if he had guts enough to handle a jackhammer in midair, he could get $5.60. For just a regular one that bore down and didn't have to manipulate a jackhammer, he got $5 a day. Now these guys, they were truly acrobats, let me say that. Just to watch them, how they spun around. And maybe a TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 10 blast is to occur in the vicinity where they're working, they would spring out of position, get up above the blast while it was going on, and they were all clear. Then they would come back after the blast had occurred and bar down the loose rock and so forth. So that was a very important part of it. Now as to the dam itself, when it finally got started to pouring concrete, let me tell you this, Six Companies broke all records of pouring that concrete. And at the initial start of the dam itself, as you perhaps have read or heard, any one contractor was scared to death to take that on. So six of them did ban in together, and they made nothing but money. Now Frank Crowe, who is the superintendent in charge for Six Companies, he was a former engineer with the Bureau of Reclamation, but he was a dam builder at heart. And when this contract was about to be let, why he moved over from the federal government to Six Companies, Incorporated, and stayed with them all the way through until the completion of the dam. And Frank Crowe took home with him a bonus of $360,000, which was pretty good money. Now as to the dam itself, my experiences were quite a number. I'm perhaps the only one that I know of living here in Boulder City -- it could be maybe elsewhere there may be maybe a few -- that stayed on that dam from the gravel stage all the way to the top of completion, of which I did do. So TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 11 as things went along, I trumped a lot of concrete to get off as to a start. Then a little bit later on, I had another little break, and I moved up to 4.50 a day. I was rated as a working foreman. I had three men under my supervision. And what we were doing at that particular time was burning some of the lumber that was taken out of the intricate forms that required lumber. And we were setting it on fire and burning it in one of the areas designated for that to be done. However, maybe a little bit later on, it was decided that maybe that was not good to burn that lumber. So it went on down the river, and undoubtedly down around Needles down there there's very likely a lot of houses maybe still standing that benefited from that lumber that went over the side. So as the dam moved up, again I got another little break. I was rated as a contact man. Now the purpose of this little job was as these concrete forms were being readied for pouring, it was up to me to get the government engineers and inspectors in there to make an inspection so the forms could be poured. And I'm sure you who I'm talking to have had a tour of the dam down there, and you've probably seen the movie as to how the dam was built. All the forms and everything were in a checkerboard formation. Had it not been that way, so I've been told, it would have taken 125 years to have poured that much concrete were they going to have poured it in TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 12 a straight line. So that was the way they did it. Now as to these forms, the government was very uptight on those space forms as to the downstream part of the dam. They had to be just so, because no rock buckets, by all means, should be showing or any rough portion. It would be turned down. This inspector would say to me, "Hey, I can't pass this. This tin is rugged here." So I could pull a carpenter out of any form that was nearby, bring him in there to make that repair, what was needed done. Then I would have reported to the concrete foreman or concrete superintendent I'd just had an okay on J-4 or whatever it was. "You can pour it anytime you'd like to." Then he might say, "Now jump on A-3, we want to pour that." "Okay, I'll do that." So that kept me very busy. And there was a time or two maybe I picked up a jackhammer and drilled a hole in the side of the canyon there for an anchor bolt to be grounded in. I recall one little incident that bears telling. I was drilling this hole in the side of the cliff there, and this jackhammer was just shaking the daylights out of me. So a guy come along and he said, "Hey, kid, why don't you get a Mexican to hold up that hammer for you." I looked at him. I said, "We haven't got any Mexicans in our crew." TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 13 He says, "Oh, you don't know what I mean." So he went over, and he grabbed a piece of reinforcing steel, and he stood it up vertically and haywired the hammer to it so that it was just holding the hammer in position. Well, I thanked him for that, or I should have. Actually, he was long gone. But that was interesting. You learned a few tricks as time went on. So it was indeed a pleasure for me to go through all of the dam construction from the gravel stage until the completion. And I feel honored to have played in a small band up on top when Franklin D. Roosevelt made his dedication of the dam September 30, 1935. So that was quite a thrilling experience. There was many, many people down there. And I recall some of Franklin D.'s talk. He complimented, and he commended. He said, "You who have builded," that was the wording he used, "this dam, I highly commend you. And we all thank you for this accomplishment that has been done." So that is a big moment, let me say this. Now I've taken you all through the dam pretty much, so I'm going to move out of the dam. But best I say this while I'm still in the dam: The trumpet playing came into some help for me because way back in that era, of course, there was radio, but no television or anything like that. So people loved to dance. And up in the Anderson Brothers Mess Hall and the old American Legion hall that was here, why, TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 14 there was enough guys around here that played, we formed a small band and we played for dances. So Six Companies did go all the way out as far as they could to entertain the people who worked on the dam. At one time I recall seeing the late Frank Moran and Jack Johnson, one time heavyweight of the world, put on a four-round exhibition in the mess hall up there. And it was, as you could imagine, well jammed with people to see this event. Now Six Companies had a nice, big, one-stop store up there where you could buy anything that you needed, so that was well patronized. And if you run out of money prior to your weekly payday, why, you could advance on your salary by drawing some script. Now I've been told, as to Las Vegas, that some of the girls down on the line would even accept that script at a discount. Many of the merchants around, gas stations, and so forth away from Boulder City, did accept that script, but they would take it as a discount, so they made money out of it. MR. ANDERSON: You're talking about the girls on Block 16. MR. NELSON: Yes. MR. ANDERSON: Okay. MR. NELSON: When I say "the line," I'm referring to the girls on Block 16. TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 15 Now way back in the late '30s, I well recall all the bars that were down there on First Street, that was quite the place in Las Vegas, had a two-piece band in all these bars. And the horn man, whoever played horn, he had to double drums, play both simultaneously. So in the late '30s, I guess it was, I got a call from a good friend of mine asking me if I would come in and pinch hit for him, hold down his shift. So to me it was a diversion to get away for a day. So I accepted. Well, when I got in there, I well recall the proprietor said to me, "Where's your drums?" I said, "I don't play drums." "Well," he says, "You got to play drums. Bud's are in the back room, drag them out. You got to play them." Well, I wasn't too much worried because I had played a little drums back in my school days, and I figured I could get by and especially so with this pianist because he kind of had a style of drums on a piano. He played a good rhythm piano, and nice looking guy he was. Now if somebody wanted a particular tune, there was a hat up on top of the piano there. And if a guy wanted "Margie," well, he maybe dug in his pockets and put a few shekels up there and you play "Margie." So I recall this one evening that I'm playing this, see, a bunch of guys, IFA, International Flatfoot Association, I guess they were, they come in from the Los Angeles area and TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 16 they staged a party there. And I guess they consumed a little more alcohol than they needed because they had become a little bit intoxicated. They were tearing each other's shirts off, and they opened up their wallets and they're tearing greenbacks in half and stuffing them in this kitty. This piano player and myself, we worried all night. It was a six-hour shift, $1 an hour was what we got for six hours. And if you stopped to go to the restroom, you better make it quick because they didn't want that music to stop. So anyway, after the affair was over, we opened up the kitty, and with the aid of Scotch tape, I'll be darned if we didn't make $12 apiece in the kitty. So, oh, that was a jackpot. And the fellow whom I had pinch hit for, he happened to walk in to see how things went. And when he saw the count that we had made, he says, "Boy, I sure picked a bad night to join this lodge. I should have waited." Okay. I just mentioned that as something. So as to Boulder City now, we'll get back to Boulder City. We had a beautiful -- I won't say a beautiful, but a well-cooled theater here in Boulder City in the year 1933. Now many of the workmen maybe working a particular shift, they would go in there to see the movie, but I think more or less to sleep because it was air-conditioned. Now I well recall as to myself, some of these bad shifts that I worked, I would have to wrap myself up in a wet sheet and lay down and try to TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 17 get a little sleep. As the sheet dried out, wet it again and try for some more. Now I wouldn't be a bit surprised in a roundabout way that the evaporative cooler, or the swamp cooler as you might want to call it, may have been born somewhat right here in Boulder City. Some mother with a new baby maybe rinsed out a diaper, and she placed it on a chair, and to dry it there was an oscillating fan going behind there. Well, on the other side a cool breeze was felt. So it wasn't long after that guys were knocking coolers together and placing them in their window made out of plywood and chicken wire and excelsior and placed the fan in there and that served the purpose for a while. So Boulder City had its good times. I raised two daughters here. And one nice thing about Boulder City, they could go to a movie and come home all alone unmolested. You had nothing to worry about. It was really something. On my wife first coming to Boulder City after I had obtained housing down here, she took one quick look and says, "How long are we going to have to stay in this dump?" I said to her, "Well, just long enough for me to make a little stake, and then we'll leave." Well, that was a lie I guess because after more than 66 years, we're still right here. Now as to the city itself, I served a term on the TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 18 city council. I've been active in veterans affairs. I'm a past commander of the American Legion, and I've been involved in community affairs. And may I say this pertaining to taps, which you are all familiar with as to when a veteran passes on, if its service is required by the family or requested, after the three volleys of rifle fire comes the taps. Well, taps is something that is ever so final as we all know, and it usually brings on tears to the loved ones. Long before I was even a veteran, I was summoned to play taps. I only wish I had kept a log. But I would say that 90 percent of the veterans who are laid away in the Boulder City cemetery, I have performed that service and a few down in Southern Nevada Veterans Cemetery. However, they do have a canned bugler down there. When I speak of a "canned bugler," I'm referring to a recording that is used. So unless it's a live thing going on, such as they're requiring the volleys of rifle fire, why, then I've been called in to sound taps. So that's been a big part of my life. I'm kind of jumping around a little built here and there. BMI in Henderson, that started in about 1939, and the purpose of the plant out there was to produce magnesium. Magnesium was of vast importance for World War II incendiary bombs. So anyway, I had quit the government, and I had gone out there to boom that plant because I had just made TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 19 electrician as to my work with the United States Bureau of Reclamation. I might say right about here, after the completion of the dam, I did move over with the United States Bureau of Reclamation, and I stayed right there until I retired. Other than I left out, as I've previously mentioned, this term at BMI. And World War II, I enlisted in the United States Seabees. Then I went back to the Bureau of Reclamation at the dam, and I stayed there until I retired. So the music has played a big, important part in my life. Now, they were paying electricians a dollar and a half an hour, if I haven't already mentioned it, at Basic Magnesium and that was big money. Along about that time, World War II had broke loose, and they were drafting musicians out from under these two bands. At that particular time there were only two hotels in Las Vegas, the El Rancho and the Frontier. So I would get a call maybe from Cee Davidson or the Garwood Band or some of the bands that were playing asking me if it would be possible for me to come in and hold down a trumpet chair until they could obtain a man. So I would tell them, whoever it was, "Now, I'm not interested in playing music as a steady gig. I've got a job and I value it. But I will do this for you, I'll be burning the candle at both ends, but I'll come and try to hold down for you until you can get a man, providing it isn't too TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 20 lengthy of a time." So I said, "Stick me on second trumpet because I can't make any of the rehearsals." So that worked out good. After World War II, after I came back, I left the government, you know, and so I really had no job. I didn't know what to expect. And I was working as an electrical contractor in Las Vegas, and some wiring in Boulder City, and playing a little music at night. So as to the Club Bingo, which is now the Sahara, there was little floor shows held in there. And I was in there for a little length of time with a small band, and from there moved to the high life. That was out in the vicinity of where the Desert Inn now stands. Just a small band. And I well recall one incident there that I saw with my own eyes. I couldn't see what happened, but a couple of guys observing this craps game going on there, next thing I knew they confiscated the dice and they closed the game down. I guess the dice must have been loaded. So we packed up our instruments and that was the end of that. They padlocked the joint. And Railroad Pass that you see out here, I could probably well write a book on Railroad Pass as to the many things that I seen done there. I played music there for many years with my own little group prior to World War II. And I played in there after World War II for a long time, up until TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 21 the kind of music I played kind of faded out. The younger generation, you know, it would be impossible for me to reach them. But anyway, I've had my moments, so no regrets there. So music has played a big part in my life. I went into the Seabees as an electrician mate enlisted. And this is kind of funny. I had no more than got there, my name come over the intercom to report to the officer of the day on the double. I thought to myself, "What have I done to get in trouble already? I haven't been here that long." He said, "Nelson, your jacket shows, in addition to you being a first class electrician mate, you're a trumpet player. Can you bugle?" I said, "I can, sir." So I was assigned bugle detail. Okay. Now that had some benefits, because while that platoon is out on that cold drill field, "to the right flank, march, to the rear, march," I'm up there, ta-ta-da ta-ta-da bomp-ba-ba bomp-ba-ba. Then I was assigned to organize and direct a boot band there at Camp Perry, Virginia. As the boots would come in, if this particular guy played saxophone and he could play quite well, maybe I could get him out of his duty that he had been assigned to and put him in this boot band that I directed. So I stayed right there playing smokers and entertainment for all the boots. And Camp Perry was finally TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 22 closed down and made a regular Navy base. So on to Rhode Island I went in 1943, the latter part. And I thought, "Well, I'm going to be assigned a tool box, and I'm going to go out in the battalion as an electrician mate." However, good fortune smiled upon me because a couple of guys I had in my boot band at Camp Perry, very good musicians, were in this band at Camp Davisville, Rhode Island. And the leader, George Liberace, they were waiting for me. So, boy, I was pleased there. This band stayed together through World War II as a unit. Estimated that we played for over 678,000 GIs and Navy personnel in the South Pacific and throughout the New England states, war bond drives and what have you. So the music did play a big, important part in my life. The commanding officer was told to jack up every Seabee in that band to rate who was eligible because they didn't have a chance to work at their trade. So I came home a chief electrician mate. Now, there was times there on the island of Guam that maybe we'd be back there in the boondocks to play, and George had said to me, "Hey, we've got to have some lights." I'm the only electrician mate in the band. Now bear in mind, the Seabees were all cross-rated -- yeoman, carpenter mate, machinist mate, and what have you -- all cross-rated. I happened to be the only electrician in the band, so that would TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 23 fall upon me. So I would ask a marine sergeant, "You guys got a motor generator set?" "Well, we can get one." "Well, please get it, because we've got to have lights." So they'd come up with a motor generator set, and I'd haywire a couple of strings of lights together, jump in the lights on the bandstand to play the concert. After World War II was over, I came on home. And as I've already mentioned, I struggled around for a while before I got back with the government. And when I did, I told my wife, "I'll stay until it's all over. I'm going to career it," of which I did do. Now, Liberace opened the Riviera in the year 1956. It was a package deal. Lee, as we'll call him for short, had with him in this particular act a coloratura soprano from the Met by the name of Gene Finn (phonetic) and maybe a couple of lesser acts, $50,000 a week. Now that was the highest paid act ever to appear at that time. George had called me from Hollywood, and he was to front the band, and he said, "Tommy I'd love to have you play in the band." Well, I said, "George, I don't know that I can get off or not. It might not coincide. I'm working shift work." But when I told my foreman down there, he said, "Go for it. It's not everybody gets a chance to play with TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 24 Liberace. We'll cover for you." So I did. I played with him. And George did tell me this: He says, "I know you can't make it in rehearsals, so I'll stick you on third trumpet," which he did do. So I was a very close friend of George. And of course, I knew Lee quite well, too. There was a time or two I had Lee out here in Boulder City. Before he got real big and was demanding of him not to make any outside appearances, I had him up in the Boulder City High School. And he come out to Railroad Pass two or three times and sat in with my band on piano. So I got to know Lee quite well. And through George, after he come here, administrator of the Liberace Museum, with the name Liberace, he picked quite a few engagements up. And I was always in the band with George. We played some dots and automobile conventions and what have you around the various hotels. The last big deal I played with George was at the MGM, now named Bally's. What it was, it was a big party for the high rollers, I was told, at $500 a plate. Two bands, the big band of Harry James and George Liberace Band. We alternated. James Band would play for 30 minutes, and then we would play for 30. So that's the way it went. Now, right there, I could see that Harry James was failing. When he come out of the curtains, he picked up his horn and he blew a few bars of "Ciri Ciri Bien," and he went TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 25 from there on signing autographs. Now he didn't have to play because he had a beautiful big band behind him, great band it was. And in my way of thinking, I would rate Harry James as one of the best of the all-time trumpet players. There were many, but I truly admired James. MR. ANDERSON: Did you ever work with Louis Armstrong? MR. NELSON: Louie Armstrong, yes. I'll tell you a little story about Louie Armstrong. Now back in that particular era as to the blacks, well, they could appear as an act, but they couldn't stay in any of the hotels. It was a no-no. So on the west side, I recall one evening after I played a gig in Boulder City, myself and a drummer who was with me, we decided we was going to go over on the west side. The colored Elks over there was hosting a big dealie over there with Louie Armstrong as the number one attraction. So we went over and, boy, I'm telling you, the joint was full. If it had ever caught fire we would have all burned up. Well, Louie hadn't showed up as yet, but sitting on the bandstand there's "Fatha" Earl Hines playing piano, Mel Torme playing drums. Oh, a lot of big cats, you know, and 15 trumpet players up there at intervals all trying to out blow each other. My drummer friend said, "Hey, go on up there and let them hear what you can do." So I finally did ease up there, and I played a couple of numbers. TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 26 And about that time, Louie showed up. And with him was Velma Middleton. Now, I think she may have been his wife. I'm not certain. But a big, heavy-set colored lady. And she did the splits, oh, just so gracefully. Well, let me tell you, when Louie picked up that horn, the joint quieted, and everybody's eyes was on Louie when he played "Sleepy Time Down South" and many of his other renditions. And so that was a colorful event. I enjoyed that very much. And another time over there at the Moulin Rouge, we didn't play, but I went in there with George Liberace. Lionel Hampton was in there with a big band, so we went in to dig Lionel. Okay, I just bring some of this music out because I think in the area probably more people know me as a musician than an electrician because I've had, you know, considerable exposure. Now as of recent, as to my long stay on the dam, I have made several documentaries. Being one who went through the gravel stage to the completion, they all seemed to like my story. I have done one for ABC. I have done one for CBS. I have done one for PBS. And a more recent one, I just completed one for Lion Television, BBC, London, England. And I told them when they contacted me, I said, "You may not want me, I'm overexposed." They said, "We haven't seen you over in England." TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 27 They were such a nice bunch of guys I truly enjoyed. So I went down on the dam with them, let's see, it must have been about the 17th that I went down. The weather was right for filming, and we went down below the dam in an area there. They set up all their equipment. And they said, "By all means, bring your horn because we want to hear you play." So after this brief interview down there -- it was delightful. They were such nice guys. Questions and answers, you know, that I did give them. They were very much interested in my story of building the dam, how it all came about and so forth. Then they wanted to hear me play. So there's something about the reverberations or something down there in that canyon, man, that trumpet, it sounded pretty good to me. So they said, "What did you play as to when Franklin D. dedicated the dam?" Well, I said, "There was so much noise up there, probably nobody could hear a small band anyway." But I says, "The best I can recall, we may have played "Happy Days are Here Again" after Franklin D. made the dedication because everybody was happy. Things were starting to move under Franklin D. There were no long lines waiting such as when we were building that dam down there. So anyway that was quite a moment. I did play "Happy Days are Here Again." Then I thought, "This would be TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 28 significant." So I wound up playing, "It's Been a Long, Long Time," which it was. So they were pleased with what they heard. And they have promised to send me, when it is all complete, they will send me a complete video of everything that they did. So I'm pleased about that. So like I say, I could go on and bore you for an hour and a half. MR. ANDERSON: I don't think you'd bore me. MR. NELSON: But life has been good to me. I'm pleased to say that I'm enjoying decent health, and I have hopes that that will continue on. I miss my wife. It's kind of tough to lose a mate, you know, after many years together. Four months ago, she has been gone. I have two daughters who live in Las Vegas who support me, and I'm very thankful for that. And I have a number of friends, musically and otherwise, that give support to me. So I'm pleased with all going on for my life. And like you say, I still manage to blow the horn. There's a couple of friends of mine that live here. They're retired out of the big band era. They live down over the hill, if you were going to go down to the dam. They play tenor saxophones, alto saxophones, clarinet. One of the guy's wives plays piano. So we get together about once a week. And I recently purchased a Flugelhorn, which is a member of the trumpet family of course, and it has a more TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 29 mellow, deep-sounding tone, more like a French horn or maybe a trombone or baritone horn. And it blends beautifully with the tenor saxophones. So we have a lot of little charts that are written out, and like I say, the monetary gain is gone. We couldn't reach the younger generation with the type of music we play nor would we want to. Because the tunes that they play today, you couldn't whistle or hum tomorrow. But what we play, you can. We had a lot of nice little charts written, you know, all arranged. And then to condense things down a little bit, before last Christmas, we recorded a number of Christmas songs, and they come out quite well. Just with home recording equipment, of course, there's a lot to be desired. But I've had a lot of fun. I've had my moments. And like I say, I'm still blowing, and I want to blow until I go. So that's about the way it is. If you have anything else that you would like to ask of me, I'll... MR. ANDERSON: You've really got your story down. That's really wonderful. MR. NELSON: Thank you very much. MR. ANDERSON: I mean, you just gave such a great version of it. MR. NELSON: Well, thank you. MR. ANDERSON: It's got all of the elements, but it's TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 30 condensed. It's just terrific. That will make it easy on me when I edit because you've got everything down so perfectly. MR. NELSON: Well, thank you very much. Those who have interviewed me have complimented me as to having a good memory and the way I put things, so that makes me feel good. MR. ANDERSON: You have a terrific memory. You've got all that stuff right there. Now, how old were you when you got here? MR. NELSON: 19. MR. ANDERSON: You were 19. MR. NELSON: 19 years old. MR. ANDERSON: How did you get here? MR. NELSON: Well, my father was down ahead of me. Now, he had obtained employment through a relative that made his job possible. The relative was with Utah Construction Company. Utah Construction was one of the six. Morrison-Knudsen was one of the six. Bechtel, and Kaiser, and Pacific Bridge, O'Shea. There were six of them. Now, I felt very good that I was coming into a job, like I say, but it was tough. At my present age, I'd hate to think I had to do it all over again. Let me add one little thing here. When you came home off a shift down there, your Levi Strauss, that's the common dress of the day, you didn't hang them up, you stood them up. The salt content, oh, it was just something. And a little TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 31 later on, had it not been for salt, I think we would have died. Salt dispensers were put up around there. And we, you know, were able to get salt. Now, water had to be carried to a crew with canvas bags, you know. I'll relate one little story. There was a good friend of mine who was working down at the dam during that construction era. He told me of this, and I chuckled when I heard it. He was carrying six water bags. They're about a gallon each. He had a broom handle across his shoulders, three bags on each side to balance it. And he's coming across the dam. A tall gentleman said to him, "May I have a drink of your water?" He said, "Well, you get your own. I'm taking this to the crew." He didn't know he was talking to Frank Crowe. So he related that story to me. MR. ANDERSON: No repercussions? MR. NELSON: No, no repercussions. MR. ANDERSON: It must have been really something to work in that heat. MR. NELSON: Oh, it was. It was just deplorable. But let me say this, Anderson Brothers Mess Hall did feed the guys real good. Oh, it was just really something. A lot of these guys were hungry, as you can imagine. They had gone through these times, no work. Maybe they had a family back East somewhere or wherever they came from. And even before TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 32 the contract was let, why, Las Vegas, it was swarmed with people just knowing that there was a dam to be built out here. They were camping all over Las Vegas, and even out here in Boulder City, down there where we'll call it Ragtown, down on the way to the dam. So it was quite an era. MR. ANDERSON: It was a shantytown sort of, wasn't it? MR. NELSON: Pardon? MR. ANDERSON: Sort of a shantytown? MR. NELSON: Yes. MR. ANDERSON: Like a Hooverville? MR. NELSON: Yeah, like Hooverville. Well, what the dickens did they call it? They've got a fancy name for it. Lakeview, you know. They got a fancy name for it. But to me, that was Ragtown or McKeeversville. A fellow by the name of McKeever who was a squatter over there, why, maybe it took his name. MR. ANDERSON: Now exactly where was that? MR. NELSON: Well, were you to go down to the dam, let's say, you come to the stoplight and you take the left at the signal there to go down. After you come down over the hill a little bit, below the Big Six Company machine shop building, which still stands there -- it is now a warehouse and what have you for the park service -- well, below that area, that was McKeeversville they were laying there. TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 33 Now, as to this cemetery out here, I recall -- I give him lots of credit -- a past assemblyman and a long-time pioneer of Boulder City. His name was Tom Godby. I give him credit for starting that cemetery that we have out here. I think he actually carried water down there in buckets to get things started. The first man that passed away down there, his name was John Abercrombie. He was a blacksmith. I was only 19 years old or maybe 20 by that time. I wasn't a veteran, but nevertheless I was summoned to play taps. I played a lot of taps before I was ever a veteran. So I sounded taps over his grave. He's the first one laid away down there. So like I say, it's been an exciting life as to everything. And may I say this, when I go down to the dam, occasionally I will go down there, maybe I take some friends down to see the dam -- I have a lifetime pass -- and I'm almost compelled to hold my hand over my heart because that dam was a part of me. I can assure you of that. So I'm taking my friends down there on the tour, why, I would listen to the guide's canned talk up on the fifth floor balcony there because he's got all the specs and everything with him. He knows all the particulars. I've long forgotten such things as that. But geographically, I probably know that dam just a heck of a lot better than that guide does. So I let him give them all of the specs, and then I will take them away from his TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 34 tour and give them an extended tour. They seem to like that. Well, anyway, Tim, it's been nice talking to you. MR. ANDERSON: Oh, it's been my pleasure. MR. NELSON: And I hope that you may be able to put some of what I've said together. MR. ANDERSON: Oh, yes. This will work beautifully. MR. NELSON: I have a documentary coming out on PBS. They've already sent me an advance video. MR. ANDERSON: Wonderful. MR. NELSON: But not to be copied. I can show it to my friends and family. It won't air until next year. MR. ANDERSON: Okay. But each of the documentaries that I've done have promised to send me a video. Rather recently, about the middle part of January, I think it was -- I've got it down, but I don't quite recall the date -- the Bechtel Corporation had a centennial out here. A hundred years they'd been in the construction business. They were one of the six who built the dam. And they started things off with a ceremony down at the river below the powerhouse there. They had a beautiful big wreath of white roses. And I felt honored to have played taps honoring those 113 they did say. There's several figures on those who've lost lives. I don't know which one to really accept. But this beautiful, big wreath was thrown in the river as I played taps. Needless to say, I had a belly full TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 35 of butterflies seeing two to three hundred people standing out there listening, and I just hoped that I could play it errorless, and somehow I made it. This was kind of cute. There was 18 of the Bechtel grandchildren there. Now, as you can imagine, some of these were great great grandchildren, and they all wanted to shake my hand. And some of the smaller ones, they come up. They thought I built the dam by myself. It was so cute. Then later on in the day, they held a lavish ceremony up at the Bicentennial Park here in Boulder City. Oh, they went all out. And they brought their people from all parts of the world, I guess paid their fare there. And it was estimated that there were about 2200 up there for this particular event that took place. I think perhaps one of the big hotels may have catered barbecue. It was the greatest. Oh, they even had a merry-go-round and other games of entertainment for the children. And so it was quite an event for the Bechtel Corporation. A lovely lady, who is head of one of the agencies in Las Vegas who advertises and takes care of such things as this, she was assigned to take care of this Bechtel Corporation agenda that came along. So anyway, I said to her, "Linda, do you think it would be possible, could you get me a video copy of the commemoration that took place down here at the river?" TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 36 She said, "I sure can. I'll get it for you." Well, bless her heart, she did. Not only that, she came over with two dozen oatmeal cookies. So I've had my days. MR. ANDERSON: Now, can you tell me how many guys were working out there at the dam when it was in full swing? MR. NELSON: During the peak of construction, Tim, 5,000 were estimated. And you put out; if you didn't, they'd can you. Now, they pulled a strike in the early era there. They weren't going after money, they were going more or less for accommodations. They wanted good drinking water, better safety conditions. We didn't have a safety officer down there. You looked out for yourself. Fortunately, I come through unscathed. So that's the way it was. And many of the people that were taken up to the Boulder City Hospital, they called it pneumonia. Okay, they died of pneumonia, that took the contractor off the hook. He didn't have to pay them. But it was carbon monoxide, not pneumonia. But that's the way they got around it. So again, like I say, after this strike, they had to give up after about five days and come back. And they were told, "You will accept our terms or we'll fire you. That's it." That's the way it was. MR. ANDERSON: What union was that? TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 37 MR. NELSON: Well, there was no unions on the job itself, you know. This was wide open. The IWW, Industrial Workers of the World, and maybe another one. I don't recall. MR. ANDERSON: The Wobblies? MR. NELSON: Yeah, the Wobblies. But they came in to try to help the conditions. It would have been impossible to generate membership because it was too scattered. There was no way they could do anything like that. But like I say, it's been a big moment. MR. ANDERSON: Okay. I think that's about it. I've got everything I -- MR. NELSON: Well, good. MR. ANDERSON: Did you ever know Grace Hayes and go into the Red Rooster? MR. NELSON: Oh, I well remember Grace Hayes, the Red Rooster, and all those. MR. ANDERSON: What was Grace Hayes in real life? She owned the Red Rooster. MR. NELSON: Well, the Red Rooster, if you were heading towards L.A., that was the last joint on the way out. She run that. And she had a son that was quite well known, Peter Lind Hayes. There was quite a few celebrities. And her place was pretty well established, I guess. I never did go in it myself, but of course, that was just a little old dirt road, you might say, on the way to L.A. going out there. TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 38 Things hadn't started to take shape yet. I recall some friends of mine, musicians that were playing at one of the joints out there. I don't recall which one, but they had a swimming pool. They were staying there, and they could swim and what have you. I think Jack Stafford owned this place. And they could have bought some acreage right there from him for a little bit of nothing, but they didn't go for it. And so look what's happened. MR. ANDERSON: I've heard from at least one man who told me that the Red Rooster was, among other things, a brothel. MR. NELSON: I rather discount that from what I've heard. Of course, I think it was reputable. They didn't have to go that way for a brothel. They had plenty of it right down on First Street. So I think it catered to better people than that. That's my opinion. And I can't think of anything else that you might like. MR. ANDERSON: How about just, in general, prohibition? The local law enforcement didn't really enforce prohibition, did they? MR. NELSON: Well, I think they probably looked one way with one eye and then looked the other way with the other eye. However, Boulder City, bear in mind, this was perfectly dry. There was no alcohol here. If some guy was coming in TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 39 with a jug, why, he'd have to hide it out here before he got to that gait because we had reclamation rangers. To get into Boulder City, you had to work there or you might have got a visitor's pass for a day or two if you had a relative here. And that's the way it was. So Boulder City was not to be a town. It was just a campsite. My brother happened to be working for Sims Ely as his secretary. Sims Ely was the city manager. After the dam was complete and everything, they were moving out. Now, you've probably seen photos of some of the Six Company housing and everything that took place. Now California Street, that's the widest street we got in town. And with all this desert here, you'd have thought they could have widened out some of these other streets, but they didn't. They couldn't foresee anything there because Sims Ely said, "This is just going to be a camp for federal workers, government workers, and the Bureau of Power and Light, the operators who are going to operate the units, and that's all." So my brother said, "Well, Mr. Ely, I was thinking about buying a couple of those houses for $250 each on California Street or one of those streets." Mr. Ely advised him against it. He says, "You'll probably have to tear it down and move them out of here." Well, how wrong he was. So things started to happen. And you've heard many people say, "I'd love to live TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 40 in Boulder City." Sure they would, but they couldn't afford it. Would you believe it if I told you some of those lots going down over the hill towards the dam are selling for $500,000 for a lot? Unbelievable. So we do have a moratorium on growth, and I hope we can stay with it because I prefer it to stay a small town. I don't want to see it get any bigger than it is. Come visit us, but don't stay. MR. ANDERSON: All right. Well, when I lived in San Diego, a lot of us felt that way too, but we lost. MR. NELSON: Yeah, that's right. MR. ANDERSON: We lost. MR. NELSON: You lost. MR. ANDERSON: Las Vegas is just going crazy. MR. NELSON: Oh, yeah. And look what's happening in there now. These hotels. This one that Steve Wynn is building, over a billion dollars. Bellagio, is it? And here's Circus Circus, they're jumping with another. It's to be called Mandalay. They've given it a name already. And we're going to see the Aladdin come down to implosion here very shortly. I don't know just when it's scheduled. And we saw the Dunes come down to make room. Oh, I don't know. MR. ANDERSON: Well, this town has to be continually recreating itself in order to draw people here. MR. NELSON: Yeah. TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 41 MR. ANDERSON: People don't want to see the same old thing. MR. NELSON: And then when you stop and think too, we got to pull water out of that lake down there, and raise it up to where our elevation up here is 5,000 feet above sea level. Las Vegas, you're at about 3200, I think. So we got to bring water up here, pump it all the way up here. Now a lot of the landscaping around here, people are starting to get with it now. They're going to desert landscaping because water is very, very expensive. MR. ANDERSON: Oh, we haven't seen the half of it yet. MR. NELSON: No, it's what you will see. MR. ANDERSON: Tucson, that's what this is going to look like here pretty soon. MR. NELSON: Sure. MR. ANDERSON: Our water rates will probably triple in the next ten years. MR. NELSON: Sure, they will. And you know, a lot of people think all they got to do is open that valve on Lake Mead. They're nuts. We're only allocated so much water. MR. ANDERSON: That's right. Well, this has been terrific. I'm so glad that I was able to talk to you because this was a hole in my story. TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030 42 MR. NELSON: Well, thank you. (End of tape.) * * * * * ATTEST: The foregoing transcript of the interview was transcribed fully and accurately from the audio tape provided by KNPR Radio. Eunice G. Jones, Transcriptionist TRIPLE J STENO - 702-648-5584 3420 EDGEHILL WAY, NORTH LAS VEGAS, NEVADA 89030